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Post by holgar on Feb 21, 2006 0:03:27 GMT
this is completely incorrect, Tomkins didn't turn up on the scene till well into '82 having seen one of the early WH gigs and became an immediate copycat act. In fact contrary to Bennett 'absorbing' Japanese noise, Sotos etc., was arguably (and well-documented in the late 80s) by the Japan noise bands and Sotos himself to be entirely the other way round. Erector LP was well-known at the time to have been influenced by Lucier, Tudor, Ashley and Yoko Ono
no wonder Bennett was prickly towards you faced with this kind of ignorance.
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Post by brownbomber on Feb 21, 2006 0:26:06 GMT
Margaras please note that my tongue is loosely in my cheek and I do appreciate your time and exchanges.
I'm new to this forum so don't understand how to quote in the nice boxes as you are but here are a couple of answers
er, where exactly are the "japanoise tropes" in the whitehouse sound?
The use of synchronous arrhythmic multitrack noise tracks manipulated in real time with an emphasis on bit reduced distortion is a standard practice for many solo and Group Japanese artists. These methods produce a sound similar to CCCC, Incapacitants, some Merzbow and many other artists. This is a distinctly different sound to the dual monophonic analogue synth source manipulations of 'classic' era WH.
I think that WB enjoys being 'ridiculous' and I enjoy it to both laugh with him and at him. I do feel that PB is overrated. Some early Ramleh works for me but the social and cultural references i share with him render his voice absent of gravitas or style.
I admit that I have not heard Asceticists. Although I have heard Cruise and Birdseed. I prefer Sotos texts in general as a means to explore some of these territories.
At the Cardiff show Best directly addressed the crowd as wankers and Bennett went to some effort to encourage a small number of those gathered to shout 'rock 'n' Roll' so I feel they were directly addressing us.
I did indeed interview Bennett with such an overt agenda and he was decent enough to engage.
I can't agree with your assertion that their subject matter has become 'mundane' that appears to be an insubstantiable conceit. The price of milk, when the bus will arrive or when to purchase more toilet paper are mundane issues.
To sum up - I like a deep think and a stinking descent down the slippery pole of depravity as much as the next guy. Bennett titilates me and Best irritates me. The concepts are occasionally febrile and enlightning while the sounds are mostly half-baked in the context of well developed experimental sonics.
PS Brownbomber was William Bennetts handle on playstation and gaming forums, and his player name in Quake (might have been Doom) in the late 1990's. He would regularly preview and translate Japanese game materials for eager young western boys. Oh how he loved the authority of that :-)
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Post by burmese on Feb 21, 2006 0:36:10 GMT
I can't think of any performer that doesnt look ridiculous onstage-seems to me WH acknowledge this and embrace it
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Post by brownbomber on Feb 21, 2006 0:37:48 GMT
The SJ point is unclear. Bennett was given SJ recordings long before they were released according to certain contemporaries of his at the time. Sometime late '80/early'81. I am prepared to be wrong about this as it is hearsay from musicians on that scene at that time.
I have spoken personally with Juntaro from Gero, Masami Akita, VOG and one half of Incapacitants and each one of them said that WH were considered a joke and were no influence.All cited TG and MB of the industrial artists, also Vivenza and Esplendor geometrico. AMM, Xenakis and Gordon Mumma were also regularly cited.
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Post by Joe Chip on Feb 21, 2006 0:47:21 GMT
Juntaro is a crazy person & I love his attitude. "No fucking comment" on the rest of them.
My mate Carl in Brighton (Las Vegas Mermaids) used to make me really good mix tapes which often featured excellent Dub War tracks...
Asceticists - 2006 is a great great record - you should definitely check it out.
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Post by holgar on Feb 21, 2006 0:54:26 GMT
The SJ point is unclear. Bennett was given SJ recordings long before they were released according to certain contemporaries of his at the time. Sometime late '80/early'81. I am prepared to be wrong about this as it is hearsay from musicians on that scene at that time. then be prepared to be wrong because it's not unclear, I know it for a fact having been there at the time when Tomkins first turned up, so it's clear your credibility regarding all you're claiming to 'know' is shot to pieces, as i guess most of us maybe suspect. the early Japanese noise artists at the time nearly all specifically cited WH's Erector as an important influence in the mid-80's, (Merzbow was into NWW then, wasn't even doing noise till l8r) and they're all still good friends of the band - so it looks like the joke's on you, buddy.
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Post by Joe Chip on Feb 21, 2006 0:59:13 GMT
I really wish people would stop discussing ancient fucking history - this is 2006, we've all moved on!
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